[TPR] Fw: Poly Dist Gear???

[Kirby Schrader]

Chuck,

Uhoh.... Hardened cam thrust plate?
Crap... first time I've heard of that one!

Off to do some research.

Kirby


On Tue, Jun 21, 2011 at 09:03, <cengles at cox.net> wrote:

>   Dear Kirby,
>
>  Ah, the voice of experience. The roller cam conversion *continues* to be
> treacherous in my opinion. Just when I think that "they" have solved the
> issues, then the old ones and/or new ones seem to appear in an expensive way
> in the lap of some poor owner. Sigh.
>
> I just learned today that the roller cam conversion in a Cleveland (and
> other old Fords, I believe) requires a hardened cam thrust plate! The roller
> cam can wear right through the ordinary stock one. Sigh, it is always
> something.
>
> Two dumb questions about your brass gear use, Kirby.
>
> One: as you use the brass gear and all appears to be wearing properly, then
> what?
>
> Two: if you use a soft brass gear and if it wears abnormally and badly and
> quickly, then are the kindly and gentle little brass bits better to float
> around in the oil than hardened steel bits? I think the answer is probably
> yes, but is the brass so kind that you simply change the gear and the oil
> and re-start the engine?
>
>  Warmest regards, Chuck Engles
>
>
> ---- Kirby Schrader <kirby.schrader at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Well, I'm hearing all the assumptions, theories, personal experiences,
> etc. etc., but I'm leaning towards the material side of things.
> i.e., although they say they are compatible, they might not be?
>
> I would like to point out that I ran 90psi oil pressure hot in my 351C for
> 15 years without a problem. Startup cold would peg the 100psi gauge for a
> good five minutes. Never had any distributor gear problems. Not a single
> one.
> I did not have a roller cam though... It was a flat tappet solid lifter cam
> ... with triple valve springs. 7000rpm was my shift point of choice.
> So I personally rule out the 'too much oil pressure' theory.
>
> Fast forward to the most recent engine in the Pantera.
> The steel gear on the hydraulic roller that was in the Pantera looks fine
> and it will stay in the motor.
> The steel gear on the solid roller in the GT40 still looks fine, so it will
> stay.
> I will keep checking them both until I'm confident.
>
> Although I keep hearing about 'compatible' and 'it should work'... This
> stuff is happening too much and for too long now.
>
>  I'm going with a bronze gear in the new Cleveland going into the Pantera
> and live with the maintenance issue until I'm confident.
>
> The material they make the roller cams out of is obviously the main problem
> and getting a distributor gear to mate with it and live is the issue.
> Of course, as we all know, the BEST solution is a dry sump motor. No need
> for a distributor gear!
>
> I rarely hit the rev limiter. The one in the Pantera is so dramatic, it
> takes your breath away. i.e., the ECU shuts off the fuel.
> Yes, I know... it's an ancient Haltech F9a, but it works and I don't care
> what y'all think.
> I can tell you that it is anything but 'soft'. It's more like a launch
> through the windshield.
>
> The GT40 uses an Electromotive 'soft' setup. It uses fuel and spark. Much
> for touchy feely.
>
> OK, that's me done ranting for the morning. Man.... that soap box seemed to
> have grown!
>
>
>  On Mon, Jun 20, 2011 at 17:25, Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net<http://do/mail/message/mailto?to=cengles%40cox.net>
> > wrote:
>
>>   Dear Dennis and Russ,
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                   I am such a dope.   I hear that the non standard oil
>> pump, i.e. high volume and/or high pressure pumps, puts extra stress on the
>> gear interface.  I guess that I am not  able to appreciate that it would be
>> **that** much greater.   I do however yield to experience.
>>
>>
>>
>>                   I can see that an external pump should solve that
>> problem.  I think that would actually be a dry sump system?
>>
>>
>>
>>                  For the rest of us thinking about the choppy waters of
>> roller cam conversions, it would seem to me that the answer is prevention
>> with gear compatibility, gear fitment (both gear to gear and gear to block),
>> attention to normal oiling passages ; attention to the special oiling hole
>> at the end of the left lifter galley; bushed lifter bores, a good normal
>> volume and pressure oil pump and attention to detail.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                           Warmest regards,  Chuck Engles: Rookie Engine
>> Builder
>>
>>
>>
>> PS: just now the newest issue of Circle Track has an article “The New
>> School Cleveland”.   No discussion of roller cams, but an interesting
>> Cleveland engine building  article for circle track.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* tpr-bounces at teampanteraracing.com<http://do/mail/message/mailto?to=tpr-bounces%40teampanteraracing.com>[mailto:
>> tpr-bounces at teampanteraracing.com<http://do/mail/message/mailto?to=tpr-bounces%40teampanteraracing.com>]
>> *On Behalf Of *Mad Dog Antenucci
>> *Sent:* Monday, June 20, 2011 3:28 PM
>> *To:* tpr at teampanteraracing.com<http://do/mail/message/mailto?to=tpr%40teampanteraracing.com>
>> *Subject:* [TPR] Fw: Poly Dist Gear???
>>
>>
>>
>> FYI....responses from Russ to the Pope
>>
>>
>> *Mad Dawg Antenucci
>> Team Pantera Racing*
>>
>> *The 1st & still the only vintage race team in open road racing
>> *www.teampanteraracing.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Forwarded Message ----
>> *From:* russell fulp <musclebyrussell at hotmail.com<http://do/mail/message/mailto?to=musclebyrussell%40hotmail.com>
>> >
>> *To:* adin at frontier.net<http://do/mail/message/mailto?to=adin%40frontier.net>
>> *Cc:* Dennis Antenucci <teampantera at yahoo.com<http://do/mail/message/mailto?to=teampantera%40yahoo.com>
>> >
>> *Sent:* Mon, June 20, 2011 1:05:12 PM
>> *Subject:* RE: Poly Dist Gear???
>>
>> Answers below in color.
>>
>>
>>
>
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