[TPR] What we are about . . . .
bob Radefeld
bob at radefeld.com
Sun Dec 4 10:40:33 PST 2011
Agreed Chuck!
On Sun, Dec 4, 2011 at 11:19 AM, Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net> wrote:
> Dear Bob,****
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> In my opinion it is always a slippery slope and
> planning helps to keep you from ending up on the black slope with the
> moguls…….****
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> Warmest regards, Chuck Engles****
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* bob Radefeld [mailto:bob at radefeld.com]
> *Sent:* Sunday, December 04, 2011 10:14 AM
> *To:* Charles Engles
> *Cc:* Asa Jay Laughton; tpr at teampanteraracing.com
>
> *Subject:* Re: [TPR] What we are about . . . .****
>
> ** **
>
> Dear Chuck,****
>
> ****
>
> Weren't you one of the folks with advice regarding the "slippery slope"
> syndrome that so easily occurs when one pulls his engine? That certainly
> applied to me when my engine came out of my car & I've got a hunch it could
> very easily infect Asa if he swaps engines. If he can somehow "immunize"
> himself against this happening then YES, I would agree that swapping
> engines might allow for a smaller outlay of $$ for him. Personally,
> however, I would pull only the heads & be more assured that my chances of
> sliding were minimized to the max.........FWIW.****
>
> ****
>
> ****
>
> Bob ****
>
> ****
>
>
>
> ****
>
> On Sun, Dec 4, 2011 at 9:06 AM, Charles Engles <cengles at cox.net> wrote:***
> *
>
> Dear Mr. Not Completely Stock Engine Owner,****
>
> ****
>
> ****
>
> ****
>
> My biggest concern was with the lousy plastic timing
> gear and you’ve taken care of that. I had forgotten about the two piece
> valves. I think the best and most unpleasant comments on that are from JB
> and Rowdy. To paraphrase one of my favorite quotes for this situation:
> “As long as nothing happens to the engine, there’s no danger.”****
>
> ****
>
> Perhaps for the least financial cost, the Mustang
> engine transplant might the best deal. You said that the biggest dollar
> cost would be adjusting or rebuilding the carb for it’s new situation in
> the Pantera. You could put the Pantera engine on a stand and then……..put
> the Mustang on the proverbial back burner of “when I get ‘round tuit”
> and/or begin another engine build from those three re-builders you have for
> a Mustang powerplant.****
>
> ****
>
> ****
>
> Warmest regards, Chuck Engles****
>
> ****
>
> ****
>
> ****
>
> Fr*om:* tpr-bounces at teampanteraracing.com [mailto:
> tpr-bounces at teampanteraracing.com] *On Behalf Of *Asa Jay Laughton
> *Sent:* Saturday, December 03, 2011 7:52 PM
> *To:* tpr at teampanteraracing.com ****
>
>
> *Subject:* Re: [TPR] What we are about . . . .****
>
> ****
>
> Well the fact is there is nothing -wrong- with the stock engine -in- the
> Pantera right now. Except for doomsayer's like John (no offense intended)
> who keep a tinge of doubt in my mind, I have no qualms about running this
> engine at 100 MPH for 90 miles. It needs nothing right now other than an
> oil and filter change, well and maybe a new radiator (or rebuilt, I'm
> working on that).
>
> Granted, running it between WOT and full Brakes on the local track for 20
> minutes at a shot, or brutalizing it on an autocross course isn't the
> same. Might it not survive 100 MPH for 90 miles? Maybe.
>
> Two years ago I replaced all the valve stem keepers and valve stem seals.
> I've tuned it for no-knock on 92 Octane pump gas (of course it's a '73
> de-tuned engine anyway.) It has a full-roller timing set (after the stock
> set went south). Okay, so it's not strictly stock, like Brock Tella stock,
> okay?
>
> No worries though, I'm not about to spend a brazilian dollars on new parts
> for a new rebuild. That comes secondary. What the angst is about is
> whether to buy in to the idea the stock engine might grenade on course and
> instead run the engine I've built for the Mach I. Details on that engine
> build are here:
> http://www.asajay.com/351rebuild/351rebuild.htm
>
> It's been running in the Mach I since 2001, just not been driven a whole
> lot.
>
> <sigh> I just need new shocks/springs, a new radiator, wheels and tires,
> an oil and filter change and I'll be ready. But I'll also listen to other
> advice. What other reasons are there that my engine as it is might not
> make it 90 miles at 100 MPH?
>
> Asa Jay
>
>
> ****
>
> Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired****
>
> & Shelley Marie****
>
> Spokane, WA****
>
> ****************************** ****
>
> http://www.racingagainstautism.com****
>
> http://www.teampanteraracing.com****
>
> http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism****
>
>
> On 12/3/2011 5:35 PM, Charles Engles wrote: ****
>
> Dear Asa,****
>
> ****
>
> Ahem. That should read: * **John’s* email is filled
> with words of wisdom. ****
>
> My bad, Chuck Engles****
>
> *From:* tpr-bounces at teampanteraracing.com [
> mailto:tpr-bounces at teampanteraracing.com<tpr-bounces at teampanteraracing.com>
> ]* **On Behalf Of* Charles Engles
> *Sent:* Saturday, December 03, 2011 7:33 PM
> *To:* 'John Bentley'; 'Asa Jay Laughton'; tpr at teampanteraracing.com
> *Subject:* Re: [TPR] What we are about . . . .****
>
> Dear Asa,****
>
> John email is filled with words of wisdom. ****
>
> ****
>
> Warmest regards, Chuck
> Engles****
>
> *From:* tpr-bounces at teampanteraracing.com [
> mailto:tpr-bounces at teampanteraracing.com<tpr-bounces at teampanteraracing.com>
> ]* **On Behalf Of* John Bentley
> *Sent:* Saturday, December 03, 2011 6:03 PM
> *To:* Asa Jay Laughton; tpr at teampanteraracing.com
> *Subject:* Re: [TPR] What we are about . . . .****
>
> Asa,****
>
> You gotta stop this! Don't run Silver State with an original un-touched
> engine since you will probably suck a valve at mile 25! Don't worry about
> the long list of $20k worth of parts you WANT and just get it running and
> run the 100 MPH class. Take smaller steps or you will NEVER drive it
> again. :) My garage is filled with parts I have collected along the way
> and if I waited until they were all installed it would never leave the jack
> stands.****
>
> Don't make me send the Brazilian girls up there to fix your engine......!*
> ***
>
> JB****
>
> *From:* Asa Jay Laughton <asajay at asajay.com> <asajay at asajay.com>
> *To:* tpr at teampanteraracing.com
> *Sent:* Saturday, December 3, 2011 3:51 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [TPR] What we are about . . . .****
>
> You're excellency,
>
> There is always room at the Northwest Pantera Research Institute for The
> Pope. The last transients to stay here were Mike Drew and John Christian
> on their way to the Rocky Mountain Tour. I have a refrigerator
> specifically designated for beer. Although it's not normally stocked, it
> miraculously fills anytime a man of the shop cloth comes to stay. And one
> of the natives has a "Hut" always well stocked with pizza.
>
> I do have an emotional attachment to the engine in the Pantera. It's an
> original numbers matching, never been rebuilt, still runs. Yes.... the
> more I drive it -hard-, the more I take a chance on breaking something,
> which I sometimes have angst about.... until I climb in, fire it up and
> drive away. So on the one hand, I really should swap it, but on the
> other... how cool would it be to complete the SSCC in a triple digit speed
> class, with the original numbers matching engine, never been rebuilt, 40
> years after it was made? ... WOW!
>
> The Mach I could sit without an engine. I haven't actually driven it in
> -over- a year. It's really in a sad state of bodywork and paint. But I
> just know if it sits for -long- without an engine.... it will depress me
> even further as to it's non-driven state. That engine is -not- numbers
> matching and I could pretty much put it anywhere I want without any angst.
>
> The engine currently on the stand in the lab is still waiting further
> forensics, which I'm hoping to get to this winter. It isn't a good
> candidate for a rebuild; it was bored .030" over last time and has nearly
> 80K miles on it or so. I have three others stored that I could use for new
> rebuilt platforms, but I don't know what condition they are in.... again,
> the Northwest PRI has no money for research at the moment.
>
> If the angels granted this kind of project could be undertaken, it would
> most likely happen in January and would look something like this:
>
> - Move Shelley's Jeep out of garage, move Mach I in
> - Remove engine sans transmission (time estimate, half a day)
> - Drain radiator of coolant, unhook radiator hoses, remove radiator
> - Drain engine of oil, unhook oil lines to accumulator
> - Remove fan belts and fan
> - Remove power steering pump and set aside (or unhook hoses if
> necessary)
> - Remove alternator
> - Unhook all wiring to the engine and place aside
> - Remove carb, tape over intake
> - Remove distributor
> - Unbolt headers at head
> - Unhook fuel line and cork it (if there's any left)Asa Jay Laughton,
> MSgt, USAFR, Retired
> - Unbolt transmission, motor mounts and pull the sucker
> - Put the engine on a stand
> - Move Mach I back outside, move Shelley's Jeep back in.
> - Remove the engine from the Pantera (time estimate, half a day)
> - Remove the decklid
> - Drain coolant, unhook hoses, remove radiator (needs new or rebuilt
> radiator)
> - Drain engine oil
> - Drain ZF gear oil
> - Unhook fuel line and cork
> - Remove carb and distributor, cover holes
> - Unhook all wiring, set aside
> - Remove A/C compressor (unused currently), set aside
> - Unhook/remove starter (get it out of the way)
> - Remove A/C Condensor
> - Unhook headers
> - Unhook transmission linkage
> - Unhook transmission wiring
> - Unhook half-shafts
> - Remove clutch slave, set aside
> - Unbolt engine and trans mounts and pull the sucker
> - Swap the ZF to the other engine (an hour maybe)
> - Swap flywheels (the Mach I is an automatic)
> - Install new pilot bearing since the Mach I doesn't have one (money)
> - Install pressure plate and clutch disc (assuming they are fine,
> otherwise.... more money)
> - Reverse the process on the Pantera (another half day)
>
> But then.....
> - I don't have a well-tuned carb for the Mach I engine. The Carter AFB on
> there works, but not as optimally as it should. The Holley from the
> Pantera would work, but it's not tuned to the higher horsepower of the Mach
> I engine. Do I rebuild and re-tune the Carter or do I re-jet the Holley?
> - I could use the Duraspark distributor from the Mach I in the Pantera but
> I'd need to wire up a computer box in the engine compartment to make it
> work. Best to do that while the engine is out. (more money)
> - If the engine is out it's a good time to replace the rubber mounting
> doughnuts. (more money)
> - If the engine is out, it's a good time to re-plumb the cooling system,
> ala John Taphorn/Dave Bell's method. (more money and some creative work in
> the engine bay)
> - Might as well remove the A/C parts for now since they aren't being used.
>
> So I look at all this and it just doesn't seem practical. But I get that
> darn thundering clapping sound from a good strong V8 engine in my bones and
> "practicality" begins to get awfully transparent.
>
> Bless me father for I have sinned... I have lust for more horsepower and
> coveted my neighbors ponies.
>
> Asa Jay ****
>
> & Shelley Marie****
>
> Spokane, WA****
>
> ****************************** ****
>
> http://www.racingagainstautism.com****
>
> http://www.teampanteraracing.com****
>
> http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism****
>
>
> On 12/3/2011 1:48 PM, David in Durango wrote: ****
>
> So, you have a "spare" for the Pantera? Hot motor? (well, usable).****
>
> ****
>
> Swap them out! If you have some emotional attachment to the Pantera
> motor, use it for the dream rebuild "next winter" [1] and have some fun in
> the mean time. I've heard the Pope would donate labor for 3-4 days if he
> had a place to stay and beer/pizza rations. That way, if you dropped
> something big, you would have back up! Hell, he might even deliver your
> new wheels, too.****
>
> ****
>
> Or you could sit on the porch while the big dawgs play . . . . . ****
>
> ****
>
> Morally unemployed,****
>
> David in Durango****
>
> ****
>
> ****
>
> ****
>
> [1] next winter = appropriate economic time****
>
> ----- Original Message ----- ****
>
> *From:* Asa Jay Laughton <asajay at asajay.com> ****
>
> *To:* tpr at teampanteraracing.com ****
>
> *Sent:* Saturday, December 03, 2011 2:10 PM****
>
> *Subject:* Re: [TPR] What we are about . . . .****
>
> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAgh.........
>
> The more I -SIT- here and dwell on it.....
> The more I want to put the 351C from the Mach I into the Pantera.....
> nnnnnnngh......
> I know I could have it done in a couple weekends....
> rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgh........
> It's winter........
> I'm not driving the car......
> mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmph................
> Must.... resist.... temptation.
>
> If I take that engine out of the Mustang... it'll be the death nell for
> the car and I can't have that.
>
> must.... resist....
>
> Asa Jay****
>
> Asa Jay Laughton, MSgt, USAFR, Retired****
>
> & Shelley Marie****
>
> Spokane, WA****
>
> ****************************** ****
>
> http://www.racingagainstautism.com****
>
> http://www.teampanteraracing.com****
>
> http://facebook.com/racingagainstautism****
>
>
> On 12/3/2011 12:20 PM, David in Durango wrote: ****
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yIn0IOD9eEc&feature=related****
>
> ****
>
> just in case you've forgotten.****
>
> ****
>
> Snow and low of 16 forecast for tonite!****
>
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